Tim and Sarah from Ann Arbor Arms: How A Culture First Approach Creates A Competitive Edge

About This Episode

In today’s episode of Tactical Business, host Wade Skalsky sits down with Tim and Sarah from Ann Arbor Arms. They discuss how their strong customer relationships set them apart from larger retailers. They share insights into creating a welcoming environment, their non-political approach to firearm sales, and how their niche in education and recreation has fostered a loyal customer base. They also touch on changes in the firearms industry, from concealed carry growth to the challenges of offering specialized services like gunsmithing. Tune in for an in-depth conversation!

Insights In This Episode

• The store emphasizes a culture that transcends transactional business, enhancing customer experiences.
• Geopolitical events heavily influence the firearm industry, with surges in customers during crises like the pandemic.
• The store sees a shift in demand toward concealed carry weapons, influenced by sociopolitical events.
• Market feedback and trends heavily influence their product decisions, with customer preferences driving what stays on the shelves, an advantage of being a smaller, agile business.

About Tactical Business

Tactical Business is the weekly business show for the firearms industry. The podcast features in-depth interviews with the entrepreneurs, professionals and technologists who are enabling the next generation of firearms businesses to innovate and grow.

Episode Transcript

Wade: Welcome to the Tactical Business Show. I’m your host, Virginia Beach based firearms entrepreneur and copywriter Wade Skalsky. Each episode will be exploring what it takes to thrive as a business owner in the firearms industry. We’ll speak with successful firearms industry entrepreneurs about their experiences building their companies. Leaders and legislators who are shaping the industry, and tech executives whose innovations will reshape the future of the firearms industry. Let’s get after it. Welcome to the Tactical Business Podcast. I am your host, Wade Skalsky, and today I am sitting down with Sarah and Tim from Ann Arbor Arms. Guys, how are you doing today?

Sarah: Doing well. How are you doing?

Wade: I’m a 7.25, but I’ve got my coffee, so I’m trending in the right direction. I’m moving upwards, but good to see I like it. Well, Duncan, we have one of those down the street, but I don’t go to my local 7-Eleven anymore because I got robbed at gunpoint. So Dunkin or Starbucks, for me, that’s an exciting story. All right. Cool. Well, I’m excited to talk to you guys today, and we are going to chat a little bit about Ann Arbor Arms. So before we do that though, let’s talk a little bit about an origin story. How did you guys get into where you are now with the business? Did you were you in the military or what was the the runway to get you here?

Tim: Yeah. So I was in the military, was joined the Marine Corps in 2005, was actually injured in 2006, spent about four years in DC area at a couple different hospitals, Bethesda and Walter Reed. And then when I came home, went back to school and this new gun store was opening up. And of course, I frequented quite often at the little strip mall where Ann Arbor Arms got its origin and rapidly grew in an area. This Ann Arbor is very diverse, and a lot of people thought Ann Arbor Arms could not exist in Ann Arbor. Well, they proved the concept in a little strip mall a couple miles down the road from there. They had such overwhelming support that they were able to make plans within the first year to start building a gorgeous new, state of the art facility with an indoor shooting range. So two and a half years after that store opened is when this store opened. That was 2012, which kind of correlated to when I was back here in Michigan going to school at Eastern Michigan, and a few of the things that I had kept very busy with golf and other things, traveling and doing some motivational speaking, that kind of was coming to a point where I needed to move forward with my life. So I jumped in here part time and then grew with this business. As soon as we opened up here at our current Ann Arbor Arms facility. So that’s the origin. We’re a 24 lane indoor range. We have three separate bays. We have a strong membership model. We have state of the art facility as far as retail, and I would say customer service. That’s where we stand right now and that’s how I came to it. Sarah has a pretty awesome story as well, and how she got into the industry.

Sarah: I was in college, born and raised here in Michigan, and while I was going to school, I lived pretty close to Dundee, which is a home of very large Cabela’s store, and I started there just in the clothing department and throughout school realized that what I was going to school for was not at all what I wanted to do, and was promoted a few times at Cabela’s and worked my way up there. I absolutely loved it there. But after 13 years of being there and getting married and having babies, I realized that I needed a schedule that fit my family. And there was an opening here at Ann Arbor Arms, and I was lucky enough to be chosen to join this this here at Ann Arbor Arms. And it just has been quite an awesome ride for me.

Wade: That’s amazing. Those two, coming from two totally different directions, basically, is one of the reasons why I love having these conversations, because everyone thinks that there’s only one way into the firearms business, and there’s a lot of different avenues that people find themselves in the business itself. So, Sarah, what is the difference that you see from working at a place like Ann Arbor Arms versus like a giant store like Cabela’s? They both have retail. Cabela’s doesn’t necessarily have a range, but what are some of the differences between working at a big chain like that and working at something that’s more local?

Sarah: I really think the biggest difference that I have seen is the relationships that we have with our customers here at Ann Arbor Arms is completely different. Everybody that works here at Ann Arbor Arms, I think, also has the mindset of they know that they are family. We are very fortunate to have owners that have created an atmosphere here, a culture that everybody loves, what they do here, and it’s not just a job and that overflows into their relationships with customers. And I think that Cabela’s did not have that as much. They’re a big right. They’re a huge company with over 80 stores across the country and a corporate office and a store I worked in alone had over 300 employees. And so I think that it’s hard to maintain that when you have that level of people working in the same place. And here I know our customers feel that as well when they come through here. And like Tim touched on with our membership base, it’s more than just a gun store, and it’s because of the relationships and the interactions that our customers get to experience with everybody that works here.

Wade: Yeah, it’s there is definitely a competitive advantage for for something that caters to the local, that can cater to the local geography and the clientele. Tim, you had said in your started talking about what your thought process and what where you came to the business that people didn’t think that the a gun store like Ann Arbor Arms could succeed in Ann Arbor. Why is that? Is that because of like political leanings, or what was the reason that you thought people thought that.

Tim: It is that, by and large, where that thought That originated, but we have University of Michigan, we have University of Eastern Michigan, we have some of the state’s best hospitals here, and we have some business here. So by and large, it ended. Ann Arbor is a very blue town, maybe the most in the state. And there’s a lot of just scrutiny on the firearm industry. And a lot of people just didn’t think that there would be the clientele, the customer base, the fan support for a local store. And that’s definitely been proven wrong with our model.

Wade: Yes, absolutely. With your growth is definitely proving that wrong. One thing that I’ve seen from talking to people all over the country, that both from red states and blue states, is that they are seeing more nontraditional, political leaning people come into the gun store. Right? So people who are interested, who had never shot a gun before in their life, People who are interested in learning about guns, because there’s been a lot of changes going on in the environment. Covid had a lot to do with that too, I think. Are you guys seeing that in Michigan? Are you getting a lot of new first time gun owners there?

Tim: We are, and I think we’ve made a strong decision right out of the gate there, maybe more so than other gun stores, simply because of the location. Our geographical location has really caused us to look at our business model, where we keep politics out of it the best we possibly can. Being in a firearms industry, politics are inherent to a lot of the things around us, but we don’t have to add additional noise to that. If somebody is coming through our doors and based on our marketing and our message and our everything we do, we put the responsibility of safe, responsible gun ownership. We do appreciate the Second Amendment. That’s why we’re able to do what we do. But we’re not going to get heavy into the politics and just promote our stances on different things. We are a business. We are a for profit business and anybody who has a need for recreation, self-defense or anything, whatever brings them, even if it’s just a hobby, we will take you as you come and we’ll make you comfortable however you are. We’re not going to get into the political debates. We’re not going to put our personal viewpoints out there, and we’re just going to accept everybody as part of our customer base. And I think a lot of gun stores have done that. And there’s a few that definitely go the more traditional route.

Wade: Yeah. And I think people have to make that choice one way or the other because they both approaches have consequences for sure. But people sometimes do forget that business. The purpose of a business is to make a profit. And I think that’s why I think that’s one wise approach. And there’s also an indirect advantage anyways, is that if you’re going to. The more people you bring into the fold and the tent, the more people you’re going to have to support Two way stops indirectly anyway. Sarah, I have a question for you. We talked a little bit just now about if you’re coming into the store for either self-defense or for recreation. Cabela’s obviously is more tilted towards the recreation side of things the camping and hunting, the fishing. Obviously, you can buy a gun there for self-defense, but it seems to me that’s more of the focus. There is your guys’s focus more on the self-defense side. Is it more on the recreation side? It’ll be in Michigan. There’s a lot of hunting and fishing up there.

Sarah: Yeah, I think that the recreation side is a little bit different that we have here at Ann Arbor Arms. Our niche, we say, is firearms education and recreation. We do not have a super large hunting customer base. We have a lot of people who enjoy shooting leagues who, you know, whether they don’t shoot trap here. But we have a few teams that we support. We do have our own indoor leagues that we put on here for our members. We’ve hosted other. Was it USPSA shoots here as well so that we do have the recreational piece, but it’s not so much from a hunting recreational piece that’s more from the like competitive shooting type of recreation.

Wade: And then so then your classes that you offer there or your training that you offer there, then is it more? Is it how does that break down? Everyone has their intro to guns and handgun and concealed carry and all that, but do you actually do classes that help with the like, say three gun, for example, or for competition shooting?

Sarah: We do our our training and education manager. Um, he’s a competitive shooter himself. And so he has a really great curriculum where, yes, we have all of our basic classes. We have classes that we’ve partnered with, the National Shooting Sports Foundation on. Um, we have ladies only very beginner hand class or handgun classes, but we also do have those intermediate and those advanced classes that they all have drills that are going to help people who would absolutely. They’re not titled or competitive shooting necessarily, but I know that the drills that he does in those would benefit somebody who is wanting to further their skills on competitive shooting.

Wade: Yeah, no. And I think that’s great. Is Again, some businesses, they try to create demand instead of meet it. And I think that it’s much easier to meet existing demand than it is to create it. So to me, as someone who doesn’t, I grew up in North Dakota, so I grew up in a hunting culture. I would think in Michigan, oh, we’re going to do a hunting or hunting just because of Michigan. But it’s interesting to see the demand necessarily isn’t there for what may not be there as much. So that’s very interesting. Tim, I got a question for you. So I know that you guys have armorer services. I’m big on my ranges with armorer, gunsmith, armorer. I’m big with regards to those types of services because I think they have a lot of downstream effects or can have a lot of downstream effects for ranges. Walk me through your guys’s program. Is that something that you guys have always had, or is that a newer addition? What is your thinking behind your armorer services?

Tim: We’ve always had armorer service. We are short of the gunsmithing. That’s just because of the space that we have here. We don’t have the some of the machines. I think our armorer would be capable of doing a heck of a lot more if we had more machines. It’s a real sad thing in our industry that gunsmiths are dying off when they retire. They’re not being replaced and operating armourer services for the last nine years. I can see why there’s not a lot of money in it. There’s a lot of people who want stuff done that takes a lot of time. And just with the manpower hours that it takes, it makes it very expensive. And a lot of people don’t want to pay for that service. We’ve had to really look long and hard at our service and make sure that it’s not just that, just a service, and make sure that it can stand on its own. And we’ve had to make some changes to that. And it’s honestly something that we’re fighting to keep going. But it is never been a department that has held its own, and not because we haven’t tried and not because our armour doesn’t constantly try. It’s just a lot of people want a lot of things done to their guns, and don’t expect to pay much for it.

Wade: Yeah, and I think that goes into the sort of the customer experience part and the relationship part that you’re talking about earlier, right? It’s hard to sometimes if you look at just the numbers in terms of, okay, we’re operating at this margin on this service, then you have to balance that against the the emotional impact of having the ability to have someone come in there and be a full stop shop. Right. So but that is a difficult it’s almost like golf, right? Like less and less people each year play golf because it’s like it’s a generational thing. And I do hear that a lot about that. There is a real limit of gunsmiths around, but I find I’m very pro those services because I think they build an emotional bond. Like if my dad gave me a shotgun, I’d take it in. I’m like, hey, I need you to check this out. Make sure it’s all good and all that. And that’s that bonds me, right? Or bonds me to the store. Do you guys. So if like, let’s say, for example, that, you know, space is limited obviously. And with regards to retail, do you have any plans for expansion? Or what are your plans for the next five years for the store? Like, are you looking at opening a new area or going into archery, or what are your plans in the next 2 to 5 years, do you think?

Tim: Yeah. So one of the things we’ve learned is in the last since Ann Arbor has been around in this facility, at least we’ve had some ups and downs in the industry. And we find out that this, regardless of whether we’re political or not, this industry is very tied to geo political elements. So when there’s a panic that we’ve seen in 2020, it’s completely changed our industry. It’s brought in hundreds of new customers, and we love that. Our goal is to capture those customers and create responsible owners out of them, and continue to build the next generation of gun owners. And much like golf, I’m really heavily into golf as well, and I’ve seen the same surges happen in golf, where the range, the local driving range, used to be dead. On a weekday. And now they’re booming ever since Covid. A lot of people picked up golf and shooting during the pandemic, and it’s changed. It’s become a third place for a lot of people, so we do have some designs on where we want to go, and it’s largely around our membership base. We want to be able to provide a certain level of customer service and at some point, some capacity. 24 lanes reaches its peak capacity rather quickly during the fall, on a Saturday and Sunday, because you can’t judge your capacity on a Monday or a Tuesday. Sometimes you need to do that on a weekday, and if you have 2000 members in a large number of them come in on the weekends, you’re going to fill up, and then you’re not going to be able to provide that same level of service. So in the future, we are looking at expanding some of the things we do in other areas, and that’s very exciting for us. But I would more or less say to be continued. We have some things in the works that we’re not going to completely unwrap yet, but we are working on it.

Wade: Yeah, and I think that’s the smart. The smart play from there. What I’m hearing you is basically is you’re letting the market tell you what to do. Right. So it’s one of those scenarios where you’re like, okay, we’re having a capacity problem. How do we fix that? What’s the market telling us versus we’re just going to do this? You know, if you build it they will come sort of thing. So I think that’s very wise, sir. I got a question for you. So I know coming from Cabela’s and you have that 13 years experience, there is one of those scenarios where, you know, Cabela’s has giant amounts of inventory, right? Like if you can’t get it at the store, you can order it online and just have them ship it there and all that. In terms of you don’t have that capacity necessarily, but what are some of the advantages and disadvantages from an inventory side, and how do you guys decide on the retail? How do you guys decide on the retail, what to have there and what not to have there?

Sarah: Yeah, that’s a great question. I think one thing that we are fortunate with, where we don’t have our own distribution center like Cabela’s did. There are many distributors within our industry who have been great partners for us. We’ve been able to with those guys, we built those again, those relationships, and we’ve had some really great reps who have been really good at supporting the needs that we’ve asked them for. A few years ago, we did join our first buy group, and that has also been a pretty good experience for us. It’s definitely had its learning curves, but we have split that. I actually came over when I left and came here. I was a full time buyer, and so I feel like that is something that really helped me understand the business so much here and what the customer trends are, because to be honest, I came here again from college thinking all I knew is shotguns and hunting rifles and camo, right? And we brought some of that stuff on when I first came here and I watched it not move. And it was very quickly that I learned that even though it was only a 35 40 minute drive between the store and that store that I was at, the customer base was so different and that we really, like you said, letting the market tell us what to do decision wise. We’ve really used that from our customers as well. And what do our what are our customers want when they come here? We feel like we have a a good, better, best selection of most of all of our departments.

Sarah: And we have some high end stuff that would have never moved at Cabela’s. Right. But it moves here very well. So we definitely have a shift as well with staff, which is something that is, I think, probably pretty common in most of the smaller stores. Right? You have a team on a sales floor and that’s going to change over time. It’s not a forever position for most people. And we have learned that what somebody likes and what they’re passionate about that sells really well here. So every time we have somebody who’s a huge fan of a manufacturer. Our sales will be up and then if they leave, we’ll see a trend where they might come down. So we use that as well. What is the kind of the current status on the floor too? We’re not going to over order on items that the guys just aren’t into selling because they’re just they will sit. So I think that is one of the advantages that we have here in the smaller store. We have the feedback from the customers and the staff here in house. We’re not in Sidney, Nebraska, trying to figure out what’s going to sell in this region and predict that because it’s so different. Like I said, even between a 40 minute drive. So I think that’s probably the biggest advantage that we have and something that we continue to to get better at and to learn at and to ask for help on. We’re part of you. We’ve got some great partners in this industry within a performance group, and I think it’s a continued learning process.

Wade: I think it’s so interesting that just even like a 35 or 40 minute difference in time can make such an impact geographically Right. But and I think that’s a great lesson for anyone listening to the podcast that like, geography matters. And it’s not just like a one size fits all with regards to a firearm business. And because that’s been a constant theme, is that people that adapt to their geography in this business thrive. And that is a huge factor. Are there competing, competing businesses other than Cabela’s close to you in terms of ranges, or are you guys how far is it? How far away is the nearest range?

Sarah: I would say about 20 minutes if that. 15 20.

Wade: Minutes. Wow. That’s close. Okay. And then do they does that range. Do they have a similar business model or are they, do they are they to a different type of clientele basically or.

Sarah: I think that they have a similar model and clientele.

Tim: Their product selection is a little different. They go based off of the top 5% of each category, whether that’s handguns, rifles, shotguns, whatever. So they’re going to have whatever’s the most current and they stay up to date on what the top five SKUs are within each category. Yeah, they’re.

Sarah: More of a more of a Multi-location type corporate company. I still think that our advantage, our competitive advantage is still that relationship driven environment that we have.

Tim: And the only thing I wanted to add about the small business versus the bigger businesses is one of the things we’ve learned is that when you carry a specific let’s just use clothing. For example, if you carry one line of clothing, you might pick up a couple fans of that brand. But if you’re only carrying cryptic camo or just any camo brand, you’re only carrying one. The Hunter is going to be much happier to go to a Cabela’s where they have 12 different brands of something. So it’s some of the disadvantage of smaller brick and mortar stores is they don’t necessarily do well with the camo because they’re only going to carry one brand. And until the customer base realizes that you’re a destination for all things clothing or camo. They’re not going to seek you out for that. So they are going to go to the bigger places that have larger size runs and have more camo options based on their terrain or wherever they’re sometimes a lot of hunters just want to see what the new camo print is, and if the one brand you’re carrying doesn’t have that, or let’s say it’s even 2 or 3 brands, it’s still not as many options is the consumer is looking for.

Wade: And I think that’s why your advantage then flips to the relationship side of the business. Because if you and especially on the training side so so my range for example where I take, you know, I take all my training on the Glock II because my firearms instructor is a Glock guy. Right. Like, I’m, I buy from there, even though I know it’s more expensive because I get all my classes there. I know people there through the training. Right. And I just know people there. So yeah, I could go online and get a cheaper firearm or yeah, I could go online and get sight or something less expensive, but people really are craving that connection, and I think that’s a huge advantage. And it’s a long term advantage too. I think it will bring stability to your business versus the ups and downs of the economy, because if you can generate that customer loyalty, that’s right.

Tim: That is our advantage. And we have to play to that, and we have to be that third place for people where they have their work and they have their home, but there’s another place for them to go and visit and hang out and be part of a community.

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Tim: It definitely has to start out with the interview process. And unfortunately in the firearms industry you get a lot of tough guys. And that’s not all bad. Coming from a lot of the previous careers they’ve had, whether it’s military or law enforcement, and they’ve had a lot of tough things to be up against. Where a macho type attitude is very useful in that environment. However, in the customer service environment it doesn’t always. So you hire the person first. You can teach them other things. It’s very awesome to be able to have a candidate come to you who has the personality and the skills, but will take the personality first and teach them the skills.

Sarah: I think another advantage, and something that we are pretty fortunate to be able to say most of our applicants over these last few years, I don’t know the last time that we posted a position for a salesman or for an. So they’re all coming to us because they’ve been here. They’re a loyal customer. Maybe they’re a member. They have a friend that works here or a family member they have heard about, you know, our arms and what we are about. So I think that these last, like I said, these last couple of years, we’ve been really fortunate where we haven’t had to explain our culture or what we expect from a customer service They they lived it and they’ve seen it or they’ve heard about it. And so that for us is huge. And I think we have heard so many other stories and the the pains that they’ve gone through with not being able to find people to work. And they posted positions and they paid recruiters. And fortunately for us, we just haven’t been able to relate to that because we’ve had the complete opposite, where we’ve had to turn many people away, that we don’t even have any open. We don’t have anything for you to interview for right now. So we keep those in our back pocket and if something comes up. But it’s been it’s been a huge, drastic change for me as well, from back to just going from a big store as well, and the amount of interviews that we would go through, and just trying to get numbers and bodies in the store for Christmas and holidays, we just we don’t have that here at all. It’s pretty cool.

Wade: I’m super excited about that because. So like I write for the firearms industry, and one thing I do is I have a wait list of clients that I generate over time so that when I have a spot that opens, I just I don’t have a client acquisition problem because I just set that new client in there and they’re already pre-qualified. Right. And that idea of a waitlist is a very powerful concept for anything in business. So what you guys basically are doing without maybe doing it on purpose is you have now you have the stable of people that you can go to if you have a position to fill that are about the culture, right? They’re not just someone that’s applying in their house that’s never been to your range. So to some posting. And so they self-select themselves because like attracts like. And I know that maybe you guys are maybe are doing that on purpose. But that is a really powerful business strategy because it like the people don’t understand how much of a problem human capital is for a business, right? Keeping good people, having them show up on time. And I don’t want to sound like an old, like I’m a friend with a 1911, and back in my day, labor was so easy, right? Like, but I’m 5051. So it just seems to me that the labor pool is getting worse and worse and worse. And as someone who’s hired people, if you can have a system in place to where you don’t have any any labor problems, that’s a pretty amazing situation to be in.

Sarah: Yeah, we’re very fortunate.

Wade: Was that on purpose or does that just happen that way?

Tim: No. I think we build everything. Well, you can say it’s not necessarily on purpose, but I think it is actually because we design everything from the ground up with environment first, culture first, buying in relationships first. And so when that’s what’s very important to you, that’s what the customer is experiencing. And when you experience that in any industry, when you feel welcomed and people are excited to see you, it makes you want to come back there. It also, everybody’s had some more experiences at other places where they’re not so friendly. And if one of the things I’ve learned about this newer generations, they’re not all bad. There is a ton of them, but a lot of the new generation is so focused on how they’re going to live their life, not how much money they’re going to make. What is their quality of life? There are so many young kids that have said in interviews. And I like the environment and the culture here, and that’s why I want to work here. I know I could make more money somewhere else, but this I like the vibe here. So with this generation being very having watched their parents work hard and their whole life and maybe not enjoy life as much, they are prioritizing how they spend their time and not as much how much money they make. And seeing that his honestly what seeing our culture here is what’s attracted them to us because they want to be part of that and they want to do something with their time that’s more rewarding or funner.

Wade: Well, and I think that approach, it makes things less transactional, right? Obviously, the most transactional thing I can do when I purchase anything is just go online and just do it and have it arrive at my house two days later, right, or at my FFL or whatever. Right. Um, and that is the most transactional thing I can do. And when you’re when you’re in that mode, all you’re doing is price, right? And everyone’s competing to price and everyone races to the bottom. But the advantage of a culture first business model, or a customer service or relationship first business model, it has all these downstream effects. So your people who are coming in, your younger kids who are like, I want to have a good quality of life. Well, they’re not going to approach the job transactionally they’re actually when they talk to a customer, they’re going to have more people skills. They’re going to have more like, well, let’s get a good fit for you rather than let me just move some merchandise. Has that been your experience?

Tim: Yeah, that’s a great way to sum it up.

Wade: So and that’s and again that’s a competitive advantage. It’s like an unseen benefit right. Where I’m sure when you guys sat down you’re like let’s get to Zoomers. Right. Like I’m sure that wasn’t your plan in terms of your culture and your hiring. But that’s I think putting the culture first is a very powerful, competitive model. And I’ve seen a lot of other people that I’ve interviewed on the show. They all talk almost uniformly, customer service culture first. And I think that’s why you guys are experiencing the success that you’re experiencing. Where in your classes are you guys seeing growth? So are you seeing more growth in like the concealed carry side? You’re seeing more growth on the women’s side or on the tactical Gucci side. Like where are you guys seeing the growth at on your training side?

Tim: It’s very interesting how the political climate affects that. And I would definitely say that we’ve seen unprecedented growth in concealed carry, and that is mostly like that is more than doubled in 2020 after the pandemic. So we’ve seen a lot of people who are nobody has ever lived through a pandemic like that before and seen people fighting over toilet paper and flour at a grocery store, and then followed that up with a lot of civil unrest with what happened that summer, with riots and protests and this and that. So it just really got a lot of people focused on, man, I’ve got to be able to rely on myself and not necessarily 911. So we have seen incredible growth. We’ve seen women involved and we’ve seen that pick up. However, that always seems to be a little bit of work for us. We want it to be more than it actually is. We are seeing a lot of women come to the women’s only CPR classes and ladies night, but it is not the growth that I guess we would like to see. Even though that we know that the industry is saying that women are coming to it more than they ever have. Maybe that’s true and maybe that’s what we’re seeing, but it’s still not to the same degree we’d like to see it, but we definitely have seen an uptick.

Wade: Yeah, the trends are really difficult. It’s the trends are really difficult to identify. I think it comes back to the geography thing that we talked about as well. Is that like maybe nationally, women are coming more into the fold or whatever, but there may be some geographic reason that you guys aren’t seeing that as much as you would expect. The same thing on the inventory side. So there’s this push right now for everything to the last five years was like your AR platform and everything that could possibly do with the AR. And now it seems to be precision shooting right with this seems to be a lot of everyone’s trying to move the sniper rifle. And so are you guys seeing any change in that in terms of on the inventory side, or is everything staying pretty much the same, or has there been a shift from AR to something else, or is everything on the same trajectory that you guys are seeing where you’re at?

Tim: There’s definitely been some shifts. I mean, you looked at for years while Trump was in office, that’s when the long range shooting and the PR stuff really took off. And where we were bringing in more bulk guns and chassis and shooting bags and shooting mats and, uh, kestrels and rangefinders and things of that nature. But then the pandemic kind of shifted in and it went to everything was gone. And then we’ve seen a lot more concealed carry in the past year, two years. So you see just what SIG has done with its 365 and how many different models they’ve released, and that they’re only able to do that because the market is Accepting it. You see Smith and Wesson, SIG, Glock, Springfield, FN all these companies releasing new micro carry pistols so that that kind of shows you that the concealed carry has been going a little bit strong since 2020.

Wade: Sarah, from an inventory back to the inventory side. I know you said you were in a buying position. Do you have a framework in mind to where you can because you want to get ahead of those trends if you can? Only because when you have inventory in the store for firearms or whatever, it can just sit there, right. And so it’s it’s hard to move it once it’s there. Do you have a framework that you use that you’re looking at your inventory and you’re saying, okay, so we’re it looks like things may be moving, let’s say from some precision rifle over to we’re going back down more towards the micro concealed carry is do you can you get ahead of that or is that something you just got to develop. And then you got to come in behind it. Does that make sense?

Sarah: Yeah I think it’s a little bit of both. I think that having again, the partnerships that we have with some of the manufacturers now directly has helped us to know when there’s something new that’s going to be coming and try to get Ahold of ahead of the new products. Like Tim said, a lot of it has been on the micro side, and so we have had opportunities, yes, to be able to get out ahead and to be some of the first, some of the first, one of the first stores to have some of them. We had a we actually had Springfield Select us. Was it last year or the year before as one of, I think 10 or 12 stores to be an official launch host, a big range day was held here and stuff like that. So yes, we can that side of things. I think when something drastically shifts, if we have for the last six months or years seen maybe rifles slow down a little bit compared to handguns, and then if tomorrow something happens where there’s a spike in this industry out of nowhere, that’s a little bit harder to catch up on, right? Where maybe we haven’t been back ordering as much. We’ve been ordering to what sales have been. It’s those unpredictable highs and of the industry that are a little bit harder to forecast and to be able to prepare for. We do our best with that, but I think overall we do a pretty good job of being able to stay in the middle of it.

Wade: Yeah, I mean, you talk about a lot of different things there, right? So it’s like you’ve got you’re looking at the national trends. You’re looking at what your inventory is doing. You’re talking to manufacturers. You’re definitely being I think the key is to be proactive about it. Is there is there a way that you guys handle customer feedback in that area? Right. Because I know that you guys really have a connection with your customers when they come in. So is there a way that you guys handle that feedback, or how much stock do you put in your customer feedback? Because sometimes anecdotal stories are not that great. So for example, I used to conceal carry a Glock 17. So I would be like, that’s my real gun. I don’t want anything to do with it. You know what I mean? So like if I would come in and say something like that wouldn’t be a good anecdotal story because no one carries a Glock 17 conceal carry except for me, and I don’t even do it anymore. So how do you handle that customer feedback?

Sarah: I think that it’s across the board, a collaborative effort. We have our training and education manager working on private lessons or classes, and he’s getting that feedback. He absolutely gives that to Tim, who oversees all of the firearms and purchasing the guys on the floor. We have we do have systems in place for that feedback from our staff that are getting that from customers. I know Tim personally had. Yeah, it’s called what’s hot, what’s Not. Where our staff are updating us, us on what they’re seeing as hot on the floor and what’s not anymore. And then that direct feedback directly to Tim. There’s hundreds of customers I know that reach out to Tim personally on things. And so I think that they know that is always welcome and open. And we’re not a business that is always going to shut out anything. If we can make something happen for somebody, we do. And I think that has gone so far, and that’s our reputation, is that we’re going to do everything that we can to make the experience every single time, not just the first time a customer comes in the store, but it’s going to be their third time and their fifth time and their 25th time that they come here. They’re going to expect that same level of service and experience, knowing that we hear them.

Wade: Yeah, I think that, Tim, I think that comes back to the culture thing that you were talking about before. Like if I go to a larger box store or like a large online store and I send them an email, like a comment, right? I don’t have any confidence that they’re going to listen to me. And so if you have that connection with a local store, I think you can have everyone at your in your classes have shown up with one standard type of gun. You’re like, oh, maybe people are really digging this gun. Even people are buying from us. I think that’s important for that information. Let’s talk a little bit about we’re coming up on our runway here, but let’s talk a little bit about on the suppressor side, I know that you guys are a class three dealer, and there’s been I don’t know if you’re seeing this, but I know from the retail side or from the consumer side is that some of these applications for suppressors are getting granted and incredibly quickly. Like I’m seeing people 2 to 4, 2 to 5 days. Are you guys seeing that on your end? And then also how has that changed that business?

Tim: It’s taken off this year. It’s absolutely taken off since about March I believe. And we were looking yesterday actually on our insurance quotes. And based on the liability that we had to carry on personal property. Basically, we had safes filled with other people’s cans that are out and about waiting to get their tax stamp back. And I walked down there the other day because I hadn’t been in there in a little bit and talking to our compliance officer, and was shocked at how empty those cases were. So that’s just a real quick snapshot of the state of NFA sales and so many people that never would have even owned a can, because they wanted that instant gratification of coming in and picking out the can and being able to take it home. Those people are now jumping in because a week, or sometimes 24 hours or even three weeks is so much more manageable on a lot of us are just human beings, which means we’re impatient. So a couple weeks is not bad and it’s made so many people jump into it. We’re seeing supply, any supply chain that gets drastically affected by something dries up a little bit, but then they’re very quick to adapt. And so now we’re starting to see the cans starting to flow again. So most of the summer we’ve went through empty shelves, except for just a few cans here and there, and every can we got in would not even hit the shelf that we would call somebody on our call list and it would be gone. But now we’re starting to see industry catch up just a little bit. So it’ll be interesting to see how long that little bubble lasts. And I think it’ll continue for some time now. And I think you’ll see supply and demand catch right back up. I don’t even.

Wade: Think they should be regulated. It’s a safety issue really. It’s just as people have this idea of them that it’s like, I’m gonna be putting on my threaded handgun to go in and like a hitman or something in someone’s house, but that’s not, you know, I’d like to have it’s not what it is at all. If I’m firing a hunting rifle, I’d like to have my hearing.

Tim: Absolutely.

Wade: I don’t even know why it’s regulated. Do you guys have an outreach mechanism or how do you communicate to your customers. So so that information. So like let’s say for example, you guys have like an email campaign or do you guys have like a newsletter, or do you guys do stuff in store or social media? What is your outreach campaign?

Sarah: All we have some stuff that’s automated through our email system and our point of sale system. There are newsletters, there’s in-store marketing. We don’t do any text message marketing or anything like that right now. But yeah, I think all of what you had said, social media has been a little bit rocky for us. But yeah, all of it.

Wade: Well, I’m glad to hear that because I think a lot sometimes a lot of people in the firearms industry are Luddites, where I’ve talked to people that like, they manufacture their giant manufacturing businesses for ammunition or whatever, and they they still do everything on a legal pad that’s like, it’s crazy. They don’t even have they don’t even have outreach. It boggles my mind. So but it sounds like you guys are a really good mix of the old school culture. Customer first, and trying to be on the cutting edge on the technology side. So I think there’s a lot of reason for your guys success. So. Well, we’re coming to the end of our time. I could really talk to you guys for hours and hours on this stuff all day long, but it sounds like you guys are doing some really good things out there. How do people find you? The website is AnnArborArms.Com that’s a lot of A’s. That’s why I looked at it. I was like I was going to say it is AnnArborArms.Com though our AnnArborArms.com. And how do they find you.

Sarah: Yeah. So also on Instagram don’t go to Facebook and look for us. You won’t find us there. But our Instagram handle is ANN_arbor_arms. Lots of cool stuff there as well as our website.

Wade: Are you guys on Twitter X or X slash Twitter?

Sarah: Not actively.

Wade: Everyone that listens to the podcast gets sick of me telling this, but I tell everyone get on Twitter to get us. Eventually everyone else is going to for anything. Firearms. I think the end point is you’re not going to be able to be on there anymore. And like gun Twitter, on gun Twitter is actually a very thriving community. And I think that you can post things on there. You can’t post anywhere else. So I would strongly consider doing that. But that’s just my two. That’s just my $0.02.

Sarah: Yeah. We just had a conversation this morning actually about is it called I’m embarrassed. Is it threads or thread. Is that X.

Wade: Oh don’t do threads. Threads is Facebook. There’s don’t. Gotcha. Stay on. After I end the recording and the podcast, I’ll give you a two minute, my two minute pitch on what to do on that. Okay. That part. And then for emails, if people want to reach out to you directly, sometimes we’ll have other gun stores and ranges who might want to collaborate or like you said, something that they’re like, oh, I’d like to know about that for our range in Florida. If someone wants, is there a contact you on the website or is there an email somebody can send something to?

Sarah: Yeah they can. Website has our generic which comes to Tim and I anyways, which is get in touch@annavaram.com or just our first name Tim at Arms or Sarah with an H.

Wade: Perfect. All right guys. Well thank you so much for coming on today. I really enjoyed it. And I’d love to have you guys back on in six months or so to see how everything’s going.

Sarah: Yeah. Sounds great. Thanks.

Tim: Yeah. Thanks for having us.

Wade: You’ve been listening to the Tactical Business Show by TacticalPay.com. Join us again next episode as we explore what it takes to be a business success in the firearms industry.